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Post by Ensign Lindsey Wellington on Aug 14, 2016 18:49:10 GMT -5
I also have already seen it. I must say i liked it. Yeah, it was another Enterprise that got destroyed, but it also went deeper into the characters. I am wondering if that Alien Girl will stay with Starfleet on later movies. Could be a nice addition. Even if i get some blame, i also liked the first two movies. Yeah they did copy a lot and sometimes it felt as if they had nothing of their own, but it was kind of cool to see how the enterprise crew deals with the stuff in a new way.
Well even if i like the new movie, i do have a logic question: When no one was ever behind that nebula/asteroidfield thingy because it was to hard to travel and only the new enterprise could make the way threw(they said its the only ship with the kind of modern sensors in the area, next to the new ship that was build on the station), how did the older ship even got there and went back threw with the new crew?
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Post by Lieutenant jg Sovek on Aug 15, 2016 18:13:44 GMT -5
So [the viewscreen] can dramatically crack in asteroid fields or under heavy duress for added tension. //nodnod
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Ensign Sebetharen Adryan
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Post by Ensign Sebetharen Adryan on Aug 15, 2016 18:16:49 GMT -5
I had always been under the impression it was just that: a screen. Not a friggan window.
EDIT: Also, weren't forcefields more of the better choice over transparent aluminum in the first place due to inertial/mass issues?
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Post by Cmdr Marcus Blaine on Aug 15, 2016 18:21:12 GMT -5
Maybe, but if power went out you'd be shit out of luck.
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Ensign Sebetharen Adryan
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Post by Ensign Sebetharen Adryan on Aug 15, 2016 18:30:02 GMT -5
The power never goes "out".
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Post by Lieutenant jg Sovek on Aug 15, 2016 19:39:42 GMT -5
In the case of the Kelvin Connie? It is most definitely a literal window with information displayed along it; who can read said information without enlarging it? Probs their knock off Data (teasing). Presumably it is made up of transparent aluminium but... I could have sworn it cracked in one of the films? In regards to force fields and TA... I /highly/ doubt it, a force field could protect against such, sure, but that would be a constant drain as there would constantly be something impacting it -- stellar debris, high speed particles, etc -- thus TA is the standard for windows in the Federation; the glass dome on the Ent-D is an exception likely because it was made to be nice looking rather than practical. All other view screens are either screens or holographic projections; the later being the case of the Ent-E. /r Am I the only one who isn't a huge fan of the excessive use of 'glass' or TA in both the Kelvin-verse and STO? I love the idea of standing 'glass' consoles such as the ones in the Emissary bridges where there are a number of standing 'glass' consoles as well as normal ones... But... There is just so much 'glass' in the Kelvin-verse it is shocking that they can actually focus whilst they see the flashing lights of their 'glass' console as well as the flashing lights and lens flairs about the bridge, STO is a bit better.
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Ensign Sebetharen Adryan
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Post by Ensign Sebetharen Adryan on Aug 15, 2016 21:34:34 GMT -5
"impact stuff" is what the deflector array is for. There is a significant chance you would hit /something/ zipping around the universe and without protection it would damage your ship. The Apollo 13 shuttle had this very issue happen to them. A micro meteor damaged their craft.
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Post by DGM Soft Kitty on Aug 15, 2016 21:58:38 GMT -5
Apollo Capsule Not a shuttle and it was a blown thermostat that the manufacturer was never told it needed to handle the change to 65 volts that casued the explosion in the 'service module' portion of the spacecraft:P a micro meteor was suspected, but later it was a design flaw that ended up being the bad guy here
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Post by Lieutenant jg Sovek on Aug 15, 2016 22:07:19 GMT -5
A deflector defends from microscopic particles in its normal operational mode, anything bigger requires shields to be up or a tractor beam to push it away. While it clearly works most of the time, there are a number of 'artificial' situations in which a force field would be insanely impractical compared to... More hull.
Examples, one could take advantage of the force field by hacking into the ship's computer and simply turning it off after bypassing the safeties through a line of Erys-style computer babble. One could intentionally target the deflector superstructure -- as was done in Beyond -- and then subject the field to constant bombardment. One could target the EPS manifolds that lead up to the bridge and prevent power from reaching the bridge. One could simply turn the deflector off. The ship may have its power drained thus turning off the force field. The ship's power system could glitch for any number of reasons and everyone could be sucked outside Nemesis style or killed from explosive decompression in the second it takes for power to be restored to normal.
All of that could be prevented by just making it a wall as is done in the prime timeline or -- presumably -- TA as was done in the Kelvin timeline.
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Post by DGM Soft Kitty on Aug 15, 2016 22:10:47 GMT -5
Im with Sov here too, power ALWAYS run the risk of going out. Spaceships should have very such a submarine mentality, where the enviroent inside is constantly threaten to b releaed in favor of what is outisde wanting in Iv always preferred the original take on it just being a screen...heck in FC it wasnt even always on
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Post by Ensign Sebetharen Adryan on Aug 15, 2016 22:15:31 GMT -5
You're using a lot of unrelated logic when it comes to windows here. While all of that is scientifically accurate, the topic was HAVING windows in the first place. So the 'just put hull there' isn't in the argument. Secondly any windows not actually being windows (Such as the one the Enterprise-E's supposed forcefield in First Contact) would likely have their own small power source, or safeties, to draw from in the event of power failure. Also I'd probably venture to guess there is no way to turn those off through regular means if they are forcefields because of that exact reason. It could be abused.
Fact of the matter is, Forcefields as windows are actually part of canon thanks to that movie, no matter how seemingly dumb or impractical the realistic properties as such. Also keep in mind: small force field + antimatter powered output device... I think it could handle a bunch of micro fields no problem.
EDIT: In response to Kitty: I'm not saying I disagree. I don't think windows should even be there at all. For any reason. They're structural weakpoints.
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Post by Lieutenant jg Sovek on Aug 15, 2016 23:42:11 GMT -5
Well there are none that I know of. The 'window' you speak of was an umbilical docking port, not a window. This is made even more clear when you think about the physical arrangement of the room. There was a console, no traditional doors, and a giant 'blast door' in front of the force field that was just as thick as the hull is. Why would a window have a shutter? Why would there be a window in a random room only accessed through a J-tube? In regards to windows being tactically structural weak points, I would disagree in the fact that the closest thing we have to TA is right behind diamond on the hardness scale and that no one is going to aim for a window when they could aim for a much larger point of the ship and do way more damage; I would go further to call anyone who tried an idiot when the deflector and bridge are clearly better targets than a window. If you mean literal structural weak points? As in, the structure is weaker because of them? I am not quite sure, really as we've seen them go through insane stresses along with their starships and I cannot recall a single time in which the fictional material windows have ever been the reason for a problem.
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Post by Ensign Sebetharen Adryan on Aug 16, 2016 2:17:40 GMT -5
Windows would have to be structural weaknesses. The reason is simple: They aren't made of the same material as the rest of the ship. The ship is made of metal composites, likely more durable than a TA panel. We're also talking about weapons than when impacting the hull can tear through it. So yeah. Windows would be weaknesses in any respect just because they aren't made of the same things and create breaks in the uniform metal hull. Literal weaker holes. They don't have to aim for them, they just have to get close.
As Kitty said, put a pane of glass in a submarine and start diving. Which buckles first, the metal or the glass? Spoiler: the glass. Though I have to address something. Every cabin ever shown had windows. The ready room had windows. Those weren't screens, or at least didn't look like them. We can address this to give comfort, seeing as Starfleet isn't a true military with military goals in mind, rather exploration. Despite fighting being an afterthought, it makes one wonder why peoples shit doesn't fly out of their rooms every time a hit should technically do small breaches where the TA tends to break. Remember, while durable, according to ST:4 it's only 6 times more durable than plexiglass.
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Post by Lieutenant jg Sovek on Aug 16, 2016 10:42:27 GMT -5
I obviously agree but my point was 'why does it matter?' as when a quantum torp is fired at a ship and hits a window, the difference between having a window and not having a window is at that point moot.
And in regards to windows breaching... I cannot recall any times in which the windows themselves were ever a problem. If they were an emergency force field is erected in event of a hull breach till a repair team can be dispatched to patch it. And in the case of windows in general... I don't recall any being in hallways but rather in rooms that can be environmentally cut off from the rest of the ship to prevent explosive decompression in anywhere other than that particular room/section.
Edit: This really isn't the thread for this in retrospect, eventually we'll have to make a thread for star trek themed discussions.
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Post by DGM Soft Kitty on Aug 16, 2016 15:12:24 GMT -5
Sovie is correct, this is about the film itself. So any further discussing on windows and viewscreens go to a new thread in the stark trek questions section Thanks Guys -The Kitty
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